Rework Station | Creating a P / S in the kitchen ....



Rep: (4)
So what? Do you think it interferes with that - something warm or solder? far from it. This is not a flaw - and dignity. A simple temperature regulation - 3000C in the flame, and for example two centimeters from it - say 2000C (not pacing). and 15 cm - 70 degrees will give another example - I like this happened - until payaesh, detail overheated. And then due to the high temperature can be soldered "leg" almost instantly. And due to this temperature and speed - the local heating is carried out, and the item remains cold.

Or do you say that soldering from a dividing cutter is better? Il at least able to solder?
In general, the hydrogen burner is cheap, cheerful and multifunctional. In addition, it can easily be made at home out of old rubbish. Yes, this burner is powered by electricity.



Rep: (49)
i900-vrn
Everything you say is true, but you forget what heat is. For many semiconductors, temperatures above 120 degrees are lethal. With such a burner, it is not possible to heat up the leg of the mikruhi to a very high temperature, and already the microcircuit case and the board cannot absorb so much heat, and reaching the core of the microcircuit will happen "irreparable". Moreover, with a “flick of the wrist,” you can unsolder half of all the details. So, what is needed is heating up to a certain temperature.



Rep: (186)
i900-vrn @ 19.6.09, 12:08*
If interested I can share the video and instructions on how to do it.

Very interesting, share if you can. ;)



Rep: (4)
The trick is that the heating is very fast, that is to solder the leg can be virtually instantaneous, and the heat just will not have time to reach the core. In addition, most of the heat will be absorbed by the tin. Especially regulation current regulated flame size up to 0.1 mm wide and 0.5 millimeters long. And if the supply nozzle has a smaller diameter - can be achieved with very small flame. But this is so, by the way. And as for the easy movement of the hand - as with any tool you need to be careful. Possible and on the fingers with a hammer - it all depends on the degree of sobriety and rationality of the owner.
Taifunfly , the instruction at the stage of writing: thank_you:

Post has been editedi900-vrn - 22.06.09, 17:15



Rep: (186)
i900-vrn @ 22.6.09, 19:14*
Taifunfly, writing instruction

I will wait): thank_you: For my work, and indeed in the household, this thing is necessary, if it is not difficult to do it, I will try to do it, after the instructions and the video))). : yes2:



Rep: (49)
i900-vrn
The heat - it's the sort of thing Koto can only be dissipated, transferred from object to object. Different materials have different specific heat and thermal conductivity, and heat capacity of metals is rather low, with high heat conductivity. But keep in mind that having in hand a tool sverhmoshny as hydrogen burner can not only get an injury. With very high probability I can say that such a soldering torch does not work, why there is no sensitivity of the tool. Soldering such equivalent cooking burner tobacco tsiplenka not in the oven, as for example in a gas turbine. Understand one soldering tool so difficult to grasp the boundary of the solder temperature at which it melts / boiling / boils melting all around. =>How much do you need to fuse the hell out of chips to learn how to solder a torch? : butcher:

Taifunfly
If you climb on YouTube, then there are a lot of such videos with instructions, demonstrations, national recipes. And if you also interrogate a friend of Google by sabzh, then there is generally light in the carcass.

Post has been editedKeeper of fate - 22.06.09, 20:53



Rep: (4)
Keeper of fate I know what the heat. Imagine such a thing - the thermal conductivity in the metal is not absolute. That is, one end can be incandescent, while the other remains cold for a while. This time is more than enough to solder Circuits. Then take some of the heat solder, tin part, and the part will be distributed on metal. and IMHO is the amount of heat can not kill chip. and about chustvitelsti - as with the soldering iron, "by eye" - you see tin melts - retractable flame. And I think only an idiot would not be able to notice when the tin melting / boiling / boiling melting all around. Especially when in full swing. Now for the interest of sealed and again mikroshemka soldered on the board of an old player. And imagine, he then worked. If you do not believe - and write, I lay out the video soldering.
And as for superpower, I repeat, it is regulated. Moreover, speaking of the high temperature of the flame, a large low-temperature flame and a small high-temperature flame — the amount of energy released in both of them is the same, but in a small energy it is as if “compressed” —this is the high temperature. I hope it is clear what I mean.
Yes, I watched a lot of videos on YouTube, but in one of them I didn’t see the instructions, at best only the video from which a beginner can understand a little. At worst, only the video of the burner, without showing the entrails. Therefore, I am writing one - so that a person very far from physics - a technician with the simplest skills of a hacksaw-hammer-soldering iron could himself make such an installation.

P.S. I propose to consider our dispute with you ended, because it does not lead to anything - everyone will be left to his own opinion, and a simple argument is a flame, as it does not carry the semantic load to the other users. Writing smart enough, stupid - does not help.

P.P.S. The instruction will be ready tomorrow afternoon due to camera breakdown.

Post has been editedi900-vrn - 22.06.09, 22:33



Rep: (49)
Explains:
The melting point of metals used in circuit design:
tin 231.93
lead +327.5
aluminum +660.1

The flame temperature is +3000 !!!
It is very dangerous to use such a flame directly to the microcircuits; it is possible to melt not only tin, but also legs and even tracks on the board.
Another thing is if hydrogen is used not for direct action on solder, but to heat the air that will be driven out of the turbine by means of a turbine. Such a design will be more fireproof and safe for electronics.



Rep: (4)
Now I explain:
Suppose during the same time on the same metal pieces affects small and large flame. In these two cases, the metal will be transferred to a different amount of energy. Depends on the temperature in this case is not all. The main thing - energy. For example, suppose the size of half a millimeter flame can not melt even a piece of tin (or it will be a relatively long time to melt), although the temperature and 3K. A flame of 2 mm at the time of melt. Discover the physics textbook, I can not remember which class - gram for melting metal is necessary to N-th number of energy. And, already tired of repeating - the amount of energy given off burning is regulated by the size of the flame.
And even more so, your ideas are not profitable. 1. Why pervert and make a turbine? After the flame, and so there is a flow of hot air. 2. Why pervert and heat the air with hydrogen?

Post has been editedi900-vrn - 23.06.09, 22:26



Rep: (90)
wow! : blush:



Rep: (49)
i900-vrn
The main disadvantage of the burner - absence stopkrana, ie equivalent sharpening toothpicks ax. If the soldering iron you can overdo and nothing happens, perederzhish burner and waffles - melt feet together with tracks + impossible or very difficult to solder SMD. Turbine (hair dryer) to do is not difficult, a small fan + something ring stove combustion type hydrogen + housing in which it is located and all the main thing that it was comfortable to hold in hand. The main advantage - in fact it becomes the conventional soldering hairdryer having 2 adjustment: flame regulates the quantity of air temperature, fan speed - air flow rate.

Post has been editedKeeper of fate - 24.06.09, 18:47



Rep: (4)
And I do not think that can be done with the burner valve - press and hold until the gas flows, and a spark-ignition - punched tap - the spark was gone. Then you can solder the "flashes". About SMD - yes, you're right - hand-soldering would be very difficult. But if you do the type of lathe - base and top burner drives - with two handles. With the third height position is adjustable burner. A crane ignition unit installed separately. Then, IMHO, will be much easier. Yes, I do not argue - SMD soldering is still complicated. But first, the jet is also difficult to control, even though no one says that because of this the plane bullshit, in second, demand more from the devices made on the knee and a couple of hours is not worth it. And in my opinion, this is the question asked topikstarter - "Creating R / C in the kitchen."
What about your ideas - the fan, the air flow of the heated burner - say one thing - go for it. I do - I only. Although I think this idea meaningless. With the same success can be made for the purchase of seeds in a stall at the corner of your house taxi - the purpose is not worth money. Why convert electric energy into hydrogen combustion to heat the air? Why not eliminate the electrolyzer of this design? or banal Nichrome filament is not enough to heat the air? Although the efficiency of the cell and the high - about 90%, even without considering the inevitable loss of gas (because of the huge capacity of hydrogen permeation) - loss will occur at 10% efficiency. Think about it: as it is necessary?

The instruction is ready, there are pictures left - without them, little is clear. In the week I will fix the camera;) I apologize for the delay: resent:



Rep: (49)
i900-vrn
Well, doing the type of lathe - it is generally hard =)
And my idea was proposed as a modification of yours. Ie we have a burner, changed the nozzle - we have the PS that's all.

By the way, I would like to remind you about safety, hydrogen is not a toy, but explosive (Brownian) gas - in generalvery dangerous (capable of randomly detonate !!! ). It is necessary to space apart the electrodes and separate them (the gases should be separated, the electrolyte cannot be completely divided) by the diaphragm, i.e. oxygen separately - hydrogen separately and the burner can either be supplied only with hydrogen, or two tubes can be drawn and mixed immediately before being fed to the nozzles.

Post has been editedKeeper of fate - 25.06.09, 22:41



Rep: (4)
Hmm .. I probably did not read the burner of hydrogen))) first, the Brown gas does not detonate himself, and another thing - very easy to ignite and explode very much. TK the system is tight, the only dangerous direction - burner. Firstly, the maximum diameter of the nozzle is selected so that the gas stream is faster than the burning velocity, secondly before the nozzle into the tube stuffed wire of copper - it will not pass the flame further in-treih, is simple and reliable means - water trap ( tube from the electrolyzer passes into a flask with water and filled with water above the level of the tube. Top set tube going to the burner, above the liquid level. this self-sealingly. As a result, the gas "bubbles up" through the water. and the flame further passes) fourthly gas never accumulates. Even if all this is not vzorvetsya- knocks even hoses - check. Edektrolizer with separate gadovydeleniem do will be extremely complexity farther apart the electrodes, the greater the resistance of the electrolyte, sdedovatelno current strength will be much smaller and thus the gas output is also very small. Yield-increase electrode area. But then the size will increase significantly. By the way, industrial electrolyzer - in my opinion, "Vega" is made from the mixed gas generation - that is, it turns out just Brown's gas, and just in the cell.

about the idea of ​​nozzles - not bad. only your idea needs to be upgraded - throw out a fan from there - for unnecessary. just make a nozzle with a pair of slots at the base - to "tighten" the air and with a narrow outlet - the nozzle will be very small and easily removable / replaceable and easy to manufacture. another thing is that you need to do it from a thick piece of metal or from ceramics - so as not to melt.

By the way, it is not so difficult to make it like a lathe - the base and a pair of guides. The third one drives them, on which the vertical guide of the burner is installed. mm .. then I myself did not understand what I wrote =) If it is not clear - write, I will even paint xD

Post has been editedi900-vrn - 26.06.09, 00:04



Rep: (20)
Well, disputes, disputes, but the instructions, or at least the video of a similar "toy" we did not see ..



Rep: (4)
ok, the video is already there - I filmed it a long time ago, I wanted to include it in the instruction, I still have current on YouTube - and I didn’t fix my camera: wacko: and with a mobile phone, the nurse drove to Moscow for a month (((((((So excuse me for a little wait, already awkward turns out ...

Post has been editedi900-vrn - 30.06.09, 22:59



Rep: (4)
Here's a video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfHRBUw70uo



Rep: (49)
i900-vrn
Strangely, I am 100% sure that somewhere (right now I do not find) reading tests, which demonstrated "arbitrary" detonation of detonating gas, the whole thing was, if I am not mistaken, that some materials (plastics, lubricants and etc.) served as a catalyst for starting a chain reaction and a metal suck oxyhydrogen not detonated. However, I would, did not save on safety. Set diaphragm (membrane) between the electromechanical not problemma, razvechto you electrodes are intertwined and does not use any catalysts.

GROOZZZ
Yes, the material on this case is a car and a small cart, with diagrams, step-by-step explanations (at least about the methods of creating electrolyzers of various designs) and even with proposals to order all the details by mail: lol :. Just hammer in Google "cars on the water." =)



Rep: (4)
"Does not use any catalysts" - no, just use - baking soda to increase the conductivity of the electrolyte. "Just forget it in Google" cars on water "" - something I have not seen instructions - or some theoretical studies, or video, or the design of the "left of" - for example, most I have seen such a basic error (but not the only ) - the electrodes are of a simple iron. A need of stainless steel, because iron (and other metals except nickel and stainless steel), "eat" for a couple of hours. And all-nozzle hose system score brown gruel. For example, I work for an hour ate half bolts under 12 key (only the iron part) that I let the tension.



Rep: (49)
i900-vrn
I don’t know, we can google different =) At one time I was looking for materials on electrolysis and I took all the necessary recommendations and instructions from these "automotive" sources (in fact, electrolysis in the car is possible, but this is just insanity, because mixing the detonating gas in the air does not significantly change). As for electrodes, that's right, nickel and stainless steel (an alloy of iron with nickel) and some other metals are recommended, but they are expensive and difficult to access.


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