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> Do you fast? | Lent
Do you fast?
Yes [ 19 ] ** [11,31%]
Not [ 148 ] ** [88,1%]
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ndrew
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21.03.08, 12:36
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I would like to add that the answer to the question of fasting (and, in general, about religious rituals and rites) can be obtained on any Orthodox website. Why is there to arrange a dispute of people who do not know and are far from religion?
Harvester
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ndrew @ 03/21/08 02:36:50
I would like to add that the answer to the question of fasting (and, in general, about religious rituals and rites) can be obtained on any Orthodox website. Why is there to arrange a dispute of people who do not know and are far from religion?

you might think there are people who are knowledgeable and not far away ...

Post has been editedHarvester - 21.03.08, 17:21


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In short, holivar starts again ....


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No, I do not fast.
Sloven, well, if it is rude: do not swear, do not swear, do not be rude to anyone, try not to condemn, etc.

it's hard...))


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Fasting without faith is just a diet !!!
yxx,
Can you hold back when others eat meat? When do you smell it? : wink_kind:
Can you hold back when others drink ??? When do you smell it (alcohol) ?: wink_kind :: lol:


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RedUser @ 03/21/08 08:27:11
Red Аlex, there are quite evidentiary arguments that a lot of people live without meat, and live well. The fact that animal protein for humans is a natural product and complete exclusion from the diet is unnatural - the expression is not at all more conclusive.


I do not see such arguments on your part. Research where? However, do not hesitate - by poking around in a google, you will find a lot of arguments both for and against. Only evidential - from supporters of animal protein. ;)

At a minimum, your whole mass of people are not fed by grass and bushes, but quiteanimals milk protein ...;)

Notice - even herbivores feed their young - preciselyanimalsprotein ...;)

Harvester @ 03/21/08 09:12:53
Sometimes it's so easy to catch on ignorance of physiology ...


Only you can not ... that's strange? : D

Harvester @ 03/21/08 09:12:53
The human body is adapted to a mixed diet, with a predominance of plant food in the diet


Yeah ... right remark ...

Harvester @ 03/21/08 09:12:53
And the complete exclusion from the diet of animal protein may well be natural for humans, based on its physiology.


And this is a false remark ... come on, deprive babies of maternal milk ...;)

Moreover - especially for “experts” I inform you that herbivorous animals do not stranger on occasion — they think about pigs, I think everyone knows, and the same reindeer gladly hunt mouse-like rodents, in particular, lemmings ...

So the expression "Figushki! I'm carnivorous !!!" from the well-known cartoon is not at all so absurd and ridiculous, as it may seem to the "experts" who derive knowledge only from search engines ...: lol:

Sometimes it's so easy to catch lovers of incompetence by Google ...;)

Added @ 22.03.2008, 02:06

Harvester @ 03/21/08 5:19:36 PM
you might think there are people who are knowledgeable and not far away ...


And here I completely agree.
Harvester
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22.03.08, 05:30
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Red Alex @ 03/21/08 4:03:11 PM
And this is a wrong remark ... come on, deprive babies of maternal milk ...
Totally childish argument. We are talking about the diet of adults. In infants, the physiology of the gastrointestinal tract is noticeably different than in an adult animal.
Both herbivores and predators can be mammals. So the calf's milk intake does not in any way determine its diet at maturity. It is the structure of the gastrointestinal tract. ADULT individual determines its diet. And fuck you argue with that. Further. According to the link given by me, the article is illiterately written and is simply a primitive PR of vegetarianism, but the local facts on a comparative structure are quite correctly quoted. And I will explain what the main focus itself is, since it is not indicated there. The length of the small intestine is the decisive factor in this matter, since plant food is more difficult to ferment than animal food and that is why the small intestine is (relatively) long in herbivores, because It is in it that the main process of fermentation of food takes place. And for the digestion of plant foods, we have this gut as long.

Moreover, I inform you especially for the “experts” - herbivores do not, on occasion, suffer from carrion - I think everyone knows about pigs, but the same reindeer

And what makes you think that pigs are just herbivores and suitable for example? They are omnivorous, "the family of non-ruminant artiodactyls" "They differ from the suborders of ruminants and mozoloogyh relatively shallow specialization. The stomach of non-ruminants has a simpler digestive system." "Being omnivores, pigs eat both plant and animal food of all kinds." Those. pigs physically can not eat only grass, because. they have digestion for it is not sharpened.
I highly recommend using Google to clarify your own ideas before speaking. Because I have long been interested in catching you on ignorance of the subject of the dispute.
And about the reindeer is quite simple; Naturally, his diet is diverse, because. Feeding on a crumber in the north is more difficult than in other latitudes. Especially in winter. And his relatives in less severe conditions feed exclusively on plant food. And it is the food specialization of the main mass of congeners that is the determining factor here. And since deer have 40 species, then, as they say, the family has a black sheep. And it eats rodents with the same relative frequency with which predators eat grass for medicinal purposes. The main diet of deer meat is plant food. So the example of a reindeer is not suitable given its species specialization. Now, if more than half of these forty species of deer ate small rodents, this would be a completely different matter.
Hehe. To give an exception as an example ... but yes. You would have cited the platypus as an example, as an exemplary "relative" of a wild duck feeding its chick with milk.

Shl. And apparently you really do not have enough knowledge to settle my super argument that human digestion is sharpened by vegetable food. I give a hint: Follow the process of digestion and .... everything will fall apart like a house of cards. :-R

Post has been editedHarvester - 22.03.08, 07:18


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22.03.08, 13:56
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I do not fast, because I do not believe ...


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taxist, 3/20/08 9:04:49 PM
Harmful is not meat or its absence, harmful maximalism based on ignorance is also harmful, look at the "party of non-drinkers" for example - the most exact example of this maximalism :(

BUT BUT!
drinking is bad is a well-known fact! : victory:: victory:


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do you fast? Yes. Posts regularly leave. And the post, I do not observe ... Everyone decides for himself this issue and the war on this subject, it seems to me irrelevant. most importantly, I think so, respect the choice of another person. and most remain human, fasting or not! Everything, PM retired :)
Reduser
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22.03.08, 15:18
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Stalker-Kostyan @ 03/22/08 3:23:02 PM
drinking is bad is a well-known fact!
looking how to drink ... ;-)


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23.03.08, 00:31
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Not.
PS Is it a sin to use quacks? Or only Russian developers? :)


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Harvester @ 03/22/08 05:30:52
Totally childish argument


No, not Julia! Noneage restrictions in your post was not, but categorical

complete exclusion from the diet of animal protein
- It was. You know, I am not a telepath, I read only texts, but not your thoughts. Express your thoughts as text - it will be easier for everyone ...;)

And, of course, it is quite obvious that, since evenherbivoresfeed the youngwith milkthen just consumptionanimal proteinforany a mammal at least at a certain stage - naturally . But the denial of this, as it was in your post - just unnatural . ;)

However, the child tends to deny the obvious facts ...: D

Harvester @ 03/22/08 05:30:52
Because I have long been interested in catching you on ignorance of the subject of the dispute.


Of course, because you have never succeeded in doing this.

And pay attention - you write yourself that a man is a creatureomnivorousand then for some reason you start to challenge it. You have to decide ...;)

The man is omnivorous, the pig is omnivorous ... why didn't you like the example? And, by the way, how is it with the ratio of the length of the intestine to the length of the body? ;)

Harvester @ 03/22/08 05:30:52
And apparently you really do not have enough knowledge to settle my super argument that human digestion is sharpened by vegetable food. I give a hint: Follow the process of digestion and .... everything will fall apart like a house of cards.


Yes, yes, teach me, a biologist ... This, by the way, is a good example of how academic knowledge differs from Googleals - an understanding of the process. We follow the process of digestion - and your ridiculous arguments, of course, fall apart with the effect you know. Are you trying to establish a homology between the digestive systems of humans and ruminants? Well, come on, only to the end.

First you, of course, lied to the original data. Here is the data from the academicBiological Encyclopedic Dictionary :

dogs - 5-6 body lengths
wolf - 4
sheep - 35
wild sheep -18
domestic pig - 17
boar - 14
man - ATTENTION !!! This is where you lie ... - 3-4 body lengths.

Point. Your "killer superarguments" - just baby talk. Gugel also need to be able to use, yeah! : lol:

Further, you were babbling about the small intestine - for your information, the fermentation in herbivores does not occur infineand inthick intestinal section (what, in Gugel, it wasn’t ?! Yes, it was, but you don’t need facts, but “arguments” ... :)). Well, we will further compare thin human intestines and fat - ruminants? ;)

And in the third - you, of course, forgiven not to know (to get the right answer, you need to know most of it), but the fermentation of fiber in the same ruminants is not due to its own digestive enzymes, but due to symbiotic bacteria (pigs, by the way present ... so your "arguments" about the pig are, as usual, past the cash register;)) and the simplest (which ruminants are digested to obtain animal protein). Well, throw a deadly reference to me about the presence of such symbionts (such - these are specifically splitting cellulose, otherwise you will start to play around ...: D) in the human body - and you don’t understand the homology! What, no ?! And does not help Google? You see how offensive! : lol:

So - you really lack not only banal knowledge, but even the ability to use search engines, so as not to constantly get into trouble ... Nothing, train!

In general, plums counted! ;)
Harvester
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Red Alex @ 03/23/08 5:37:51 PM
Harvester 03/22/08 05:30:52
Totally childish argument


No, not Julia! Noneage restrictions in your post was not, but categorical

complete exclusion from the diet of animal protein
- It was. You know, I am not a telepath, I read only texts, but not your thoughts. Express your thoughts as text - it will be easier for everyone ...;)

I am glad that you are not arguing with this: "It is the structure of the gastrointestinal tract of the ADULT individual that determines its diet."
And the words about "complete exclusion from the ration of animal protein ”refers specifically to an adult animal. There’s no need to be a telepath. Any bullshit, as will be indicated below.

And, of course, it is quite obvious that, since evenherbivoresfeed the youngwith milkthen just consumptionanimal proteinforany a mammal at least at a certain stage - naturally .

Exactly.
Only where is my post about "And the complete exclusion from the diet of animal protein may well be natural for man, based on his physiology." which you pulled to your ears? Your this statement does not violate mine in any way. It turns out that it is you who need to more fully form your thoughts and add clarifying words “at a certain stage” so that it does not look serious at all. Because at least at a certain stage consumption is NOT at all natural.animal proteinforany mammal
And in the light of the above, yours sounds the same as this:
"And, of course, it is quite obvious that since even the embryo of many herbivores hasgill archesthen the ability to breathe the gills under water in a mammal, at least at a certain stage, wasnatural"You can also say that the tail at a certain stage is natural for humans and the chord instead of the spine too. But this is all bullshit. So the characteristics of a living organism during adulthood are in no way an indicator of the capabilities of the features or specializations of its adult stage. And They cannot serve as an adequate example in this case, that is, one does not imply another thing, babies are just carnivorous and periodically, well, just put your example of babies just not in the dark remark.


Harvester @ 03/22/08 05:30:52
Because I have long been interested in catching you on ignorance of the subject of the dispute.


Of course, because you have never succeeded in doing this.

Yeah ... so weak I ruined you ... not noticeably enough. Ok, I really am not entertained by dancing on the bones and practicing self-admiration, but for you (hehe), I am ready to take the sin of being caught in it.


Well, finally, after the mutual unfounded truffling came to the finish:
"a person is 3-4 body lengths." Yeah, let it be so. The only key to everything is fiber.
"fermentation in herbivores does not occurfineand inthick intestinal section "
"the fermentation of fiber in the same ruminant is not due to its own digestive enzymes, but due to symbiotic bacteria"
Hehe, well, finally. Only this in no way diminishes the importance of the small intestine for digestion, because it is the main process of digestion and assimilation of food. But it says only that you did not correctly understand what was written in the reference book and that it is in the large intestine that the symbiotes help the herbivore to digest the specific fiber, the most difficult to digest structure in plant foods. What, in fact, is not a man. Those. a person is physically incapable of fully assimilating plant food, unlike herbivores. That is what I meant by saying that it is necessary to trace the process of digestion and any arguments "for vegetarianism by science" will fall apart.


And pay attention - you write yourself that a man is a creatureomnivorousand then for some reason you start to challenge it. You have to decide ...;)

The man is omnivorous, the pig is omnivorous ... why didn't you like the example?

I myself write this way because I know that the point of view “vegetarianism for a person is naturally” is devoid of the basis (the word about the house of cards). And a man is really more pig than a noble lion or a graceful deer. This is normal. Vegetarians believe perverts who go against their own nature in which more than two million temporary experience. Those. pissing against the wind, they probably like the smell of their own urine on their clothes. Although their religion is often based on ignorance for many, many ....
But after 500 years so, 500,000 may be worth talking about vegetarianism as a natural one. Although then maybe the food will no longer be needed in the usual sense of its purpose ....


In general, plums counted!

However, yes ... Ie. You yourself have first written a lot of unsubstantiated stuff, then I “banged you” and you went to Google books for information. I realized that with me without encyclopedic data not to cope. I found what I had planned and envisaged, then, skipping and choking and stumbling, rushed to tell me joyfully, and then he himself decided that I was allowed to drain. Well, well, do you inspire yourself as a calm and self-satisfaction? Funny, funny. I understand if third-party literate people made such a conclusion, and so ... you just do not overdo it with self-satisfaction, something may fall off ...: wink_kind:


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Oh, you blah .... and you did not break the flow of the booklet to write something? O.o And the market is niochem ...


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Metalik,
I, as probably already everyone, broke even to read what they write there: D
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And a man is really more pig than a noble lion or a graceful deer. This is normal. Vegetarians believe perverts who go against their own nature in which more than two million temporary experience.


Well, from this it was necessary to begin! So we are allies? Why was it to increase the entropy of the universe? : lol:

That is what I meant by saying that it is necessary to trace the process of digestion and any arguments "for vegetarianism by science" will fall apart.


Aaaa ... Well, I repeat again - express your thoughts more clearly. Personally, I have the opposite opinion from your post - you say that the arguments will fall apartvs vegetarianism ... which is, of course, too presumptuous of you.

However, even now yoursthe presentthe arguments are more like excuses - well, when you realized that you were defending, andNowtrying to pretend that everything was originally intended ...;)

In general - "I do not believe!" (c) You remember whose.

I found what I had planned and envisaged, then, skipping and choking and stumbling, rushed to tell me joyfully, and then he himself decided that I was allowed to drain. Well, well, do you inspire yourself as a calm and self-satisfaction? Funny, funny. I understand if outside literate people made such a conclusion, and so ... you just do not overdo it with self-satisfaction, something may fall off ...


Yes, very convincing! : lol:
Do you really encounter an opponent for the first time on the forum, surpassing you in all respects? It’s just not noticeable to experience a decent loss: you make up childish unpersuasive excuses, and then you unobtrusively attribute your motivation to your opponent ... in particular, your projection of your own problems and ways of comfort and self-satisfaction (which you have already revealed in other topics) are characteristic only for you - not forget it! ;)

True, after this post you had to raise your self-esteem for a long time in your usual way? ;)

I can not refrain from quotes from another topic, but with a question mark:

Harvester @ 03/09/08 01:12:58
just pissing hurts ...
??? ;)

As for competent users on this issue, I am afraid, so far only one has spoken - and that is not quite the topic, since diet and fasting are not homologues. :)
Moreover, I will say secretly that out of all the users of the forum, I find it interesting and meaningful only the opinion of one of its members ... and this is not you (unfortunately, not you (I am writing without it)).


And the market is nothing ...


Well, well, safer - ifyouyou don't understand what you are talking about, you shouldn't think thateverythingalso incompetent ...;)
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Red Alex @ 03/24/08 7:00:36 PM
Harvester 03/24/08 07:31:16
And a man is really more pig than a noble lion or a graceful deer. This is normal. Vegetarians believe perverts who go against their own nature in which more than two million temporary experience.


Well, from this it was necessary to begin! So we are allies? Why was it to increase the entropy of the universe? : lol:

Well, at first I was amused by the fact that you always predictably react to certain sentences that are built in a certain way. Then I got used to it. And right now, I just wanted to use it a little bit differently. As, for example, in this case. After such your passionate opus with a mass of arguments against the position of "vegetarianism is natural," no one can argue with the objective. Vegetarianism is not natural and all this will be swallowed up as a fact. What, in fact, I wanted, and whoever seems to “beat” in general the most boring motive with my experience .... I often build a dispute in such a way, though unless of course your opponent is intelligent enough, otherwise you have to finish writing yourself. Well, those are my Kaschanite skills ...
At the same time I will pump you a little ... You are like an adult, and you always play a limited game according to the rules of your opponent. Generally you have a unique case. You're smart, but not insightful. It is as if being a magnificent and very capable racehorse, but having a panic of noise at the racetrack. She is able to overtake all, but never reaches the finish line, because. cannot surpass the external. Although it is rather the costs of the system that has formed you. The habitual lulling course of things has ruined a lot of interesting things in you as you age. You really are not a creator, but an ideal interpreter or performer. And in vain, everything could be different ... although, it is not too late to deploy everything until it is completely dead. :) Well, it is, for a change ...

That is what I meant by saying that it is necessary to trace the process of digestion and any arguments "for vegetarianism by science" will fall apart.


Aaaa ... Well, I repeat again - express your thoughts more clearly. Personally, I have the opposite opinion from your post - you say that the arguments will fall apartvs vegetarianism ... which is, of course, too presumptuous of you.

Well yes. So there is just a hint. Well, you always underestimate the other side. And yes, by the way, such bases are standard practice. The only thing is that I am careless and here you are right, it was worth playing thinner with you. :)
So you found fiber - this is a plus. The downside is that without a dictionary your laudatory education did not help you, otherwise you would immediately give an ending to the argument, without bullshit about infants and other original words and words.

  Do you really encounter an opponent for the first time on the forum, surpassing you in all respects? Just not noticeable experience worthy of loss: you invent childish unconvincing excuses, and then unobtrusively attribute your motivation to your opponent ...

I did not see opponents capable of surpassing - I saw equals. And I saw those with richer my imagination. And also those who simply are not conducted and put their frames in the dialogue over mine. :)
And I do not invent, and with you I follow my goals and interests. If it were otherwise, you would immediately say about fiber without leaving me a chance. And so it turns out as it was intended that it was I who motivated you to climb into the dictionary and finally give out what put a fat cross on the "natural". True, I still had to explain to you what you read there, but these are trifles ...: wink_kind:


  True, after this post you had to raise your self-esteem for a long time in your usual way? ;)

  I can not refrain from quotes from another topic, but with a question mark:
"just pissing hurts .."

Well then! And thank you very much for being so attentive to my persona and especially looking at what I have written this time lately. Trying to flatter me? : lol: Of course, of course, you watch my adventures so closely because I'm not interested in you. Naturally, the interest is nothing to do with and you get it on its own, reflexively. Maybe you already at night because of me not sleeping? : lol:


Shl.

Moreover, I will say secretly that out of all the users of the forum, I find it interesting and meaningful only the opinion of one of its members ... and this is not you (unfortunately, not you (I am writing without it)).
Oh, you just don’t need to make secrets here and give out false revelations. I do not punch a pitying tear.
And about someone's left interest / uninteresting, I do not worry. : wink


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Red Alex, Harvester,

Break !!!

Closer to the topic. And then the flood begins.
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M
Red Alex, Harvestercool it down.

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